ایک قادیانی سے میرا مباحثہ۔ جیتا کون؟

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

beshak hum tarjuma nahin kar saktey tarjuma howa howa ho ga ap hadees ki kitab doondain aur tarjuma beshak apney maslak ka karain bat ye hi aye gi.

[Irfan_shah]

AP NE KAHA AUR MAIN B SAMAJTA HOON K YE HADEES SAHI HAI.AP NE JO TARJUMA KIYA HAI WO KUCH YOON HAI K AISA KABHI NAHIN HOWA YE SIRF MASIH K TIME HI HONA THA.AB AP YE BATAYE K JIS TIME YE HOWA THA PEHLI DAFA US TIME KOI MASIH HONA CHAHIYE THA AUR AGAR FARZ KARO KAL KOI MASIH HONEY KA DAWA KARTA HAI TO WO TO JUTA HO GAYE GA NA IS BAT SE TO AP NE SAF HI LAPET DI MEHDI KI Q K KAL AP HI KA KOI ADMIN MASIH HONEY KA DAWA KAREY TO WO LAZMIN JHOTA HO GA AP K TARJUMEY K MUTABIK.



BAT YE HAI MEREY BHAI TARJUMA KARTEY WAQAT ALFAZ KA FARAK HO SAKTA HAI MAFHOOM KA NAHIN.
HADEES KA MAFHOOM HAI JAB YE WAQIYA HO GA US WAQAT KOI DAWEY DAR ZAROOR HO GA MEHDI KA. PEHLEY MEHDI KA HONA AUR US K BAD YE WAQIYA HONA MAQSOOD HAI IS HADEES MAIN. MEREY KHAYAL MAIN JAHAN TAK MAIN IS HADEES KO SAMJA HOON.

جناب احسان صاحب
آپ پلیز میری اس پوسٹ کو زرا غور سے پڑھ لیں
میں نے اس میں اس حدیث کا مکمل مفہوم بیان کیا ہے
آپ ایک بار اور پڑھ لیں
باقی جو میں نے یہ ترجمہ کیا ہے
یہ کسی مولوی نے نہیں میرے جاننے والے دوعام ادمیوں نے کیا ہے

DOOSRI BAT SHAH G IS KI BEHAS KA FAIDA US
WAQAT HAI JAB HUM APNEY PEHLEY AKEDEY SE AGEY BARAIN.(WAFAT E MASIH)

سوال پھلی اور دوسری بات کا نہیں ہوتا
سوال دعوے کے سچے اور جھوٹے ہونے کا ہوتا
کیونکہ کوءی سچا نبی اپنے کسی بھی دعوے میں غلط نہیں ہو سکتا
چاہے وہ پہلا ہو یا دوسرا
شکریہ

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

bhai jan main ne ghor kar liya hai ab ap ki bari hai zara ghor karney ki.

Alfaz hain jab se zamenon asman baney hain ye nishan kisi mamoor k liye nahin zahir howa hai.(mamoor k liye)

yani kisi guzishta nabhi k liye zahir nahin howa hai (waisey honey ki gunjaish hai is hadees main).


Hadees k alfaz k ro se aur meri samaj k hisab se in nishanoon k ronuma honey se pehley mehdi ka hona zaroori hai.

Aur ye bat mirza sahib par sabit hoti hai.
Isi tarha howa tha medi ka dawey dar b tha aur ulman k etraz b tha k mehdi ki nishani hai k chand aur sooraj giran ho ga aur phir ho jata hai zahir ye nishan to ulman ranain peet letey hain k ab to log gumrah ho jain gey q k chand aur sooraj ko b gerehan lag gaya hai.




Charoon batain sahi hain aur poori safai se sabit hoi thin.



Aur tarjuma ap ka b sahi hai.

[Irfan_shah]

BHAI JAN MAIN NE GHOR KAR LIYA HAI AB AP
KI BARI HAI ZARA GHOR KARNEY KI.

ALFAZ HAIN JAB SE ZAMENON ASMAN BANEY HAIN YE
NISHAN KISI MAMOOR K LIYE NAHIN ZAHIR HOWA HAI.(MAMOOR K LIYE)

YANI KISI GUZISHTA NABHI K LIYE ZAHIR NAHIN HOWA HAI
(WAISEY HONEY KI GUNJAISH HAI IS HADEES MAIN).


HADEES K ALFAZ K RO SE AUR MERI SAMAJ K HISAB SE IN
NISHANOON K RONUMA HONEY SE PEHLEY MEHDI KA HONA
ZAROORI HAI.

AUR YE BAT MIRZA SAHIB PAR SABIT HOTI HAI.
ISI TARHA HOWA THA MEDI KA DAWEY DAR B THA AUR
ULMAN K ETRAZ B THA K MEHDI KI NISHANI HAI K CHAND
AUR SOORAJ GIRAN HO GA AUR PHIR HO JATA HAI ZAHIR YE
NISHAN TO ULMAN RANAIN PEET LETEY HAIN K AB TO LOG
GUMRAH HO JAIN GEY Q K CHAND AUR SOORAJ KO B
GEREHAN LAG GAYA HAI.




CHAROON BATAIN SAHI HAIN AUR POORI SAFAI SE SABIT HOI THIN.



AUR TARJUMA AP KA B SAHI HAI.

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

chand girehan ki tarekhain yahi 3 hain aur sooraj girahan ki 27,28,29 hain.
Aur jahan tak ab waley tarjumey ki bat hai wo ap ghalat kar rahey hain main ne jo tarjuma ap ka kaha tha k wo b sahi hai wo sirif aik jumla tha jab se asman aur zameen baney hain kabhi nahin howa hai.


Chand aur sooraj ka safar hai ye jab se ye baney hain isi tarha hai aur ye khuda ka kanoon hain aur is main koi tabdelli nahin dekho gay ap yani chand aur sooraj ki raftar ab ap jo keh rahey hain is main allah ka kanoon tootta hai jo mumkin nahin hai.
Ap beshak mehdi honey ka dawa karo hamain koi etraz nahin hai pata nahin kitney dawey dar mirza sahib se pehley guzar chukey hain jin ka koi poochney wala nahin hai ap kar lo gay to kudha ka kya bighar lo gay.jo mirza sahib se pehley dawa karney waloon ne bighar liya


ab main ap ko tarjuma batataoon hoon aur is main un char batoon k ilawa jo sab se zaroori hai wo b batatoon hoon wo hai mehdi ka hona.



Hamarey mehdi k do nishan hain aur jab se zameen o asman baney hain kabhi zahir nahin howey hian(yani agar mehdi ka dawey dar na ho to beshak zahir howey hoon) is main se aik ye k ramzan k maheney main chand girehan is ki pehley rat main ho ga.(yani chand girahan ki jo ratain hain)aur sooraj girhan us k dinon main se darmiyan k din main ho ga(yani sooraj girhan ki tarekhon main se darmiyani)



ab yahan bat ho rahi hai hamarey mehdi ki(mehdi k dawey dar to bohat they mirza sahib se pehley)yani sachey mehdi ki jis ka nabhi kareem ne hamarey keh kar mohar laga di k jo mehdi ka dawey dar sacha ho ga us k hotey howey ye nishan zahir ho ga.aur ye aisa waqiya hai k kabhi roonuman nahin howa na ho ga (mirz sahib se pehley aur na bad main)beshak ap try kar lo.


Jo tarjuman main ne kaha tha k ap ka sahi hai us main aik bat hiden hai jo hum tarjuma kartey waqat zahir kartey hain(yani kisi mamor k liye zahir nahin howa)

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

aur aik aur bat ye to aik nishani hai ap ko senkroon nishaniyan milain gi mehdi ki.jo apney waqt par zahir hoin.

For example dajal ka kharooj.
Dajal ka ghada.

[Irfan_shah]

CHAND GIREHAN KI TAREKHAIN YAHI 3 HAIN AUR SOORAJ GIRAHAN KI 27,28,29 HAIN.
AUR JAHAN TAK AB WALEY TARJUMEY KI BAT HAI WO AP GHALAT KAR RAHEY HAIN MAIN NE JO TARJUMA AP KA KAHA THA K WO B SAHI HAI WO SIRIF AIK JUMLA THA JAB SE ASMAN AUR ZAMEEN BANEY HAIN KABHI NAHIN HOWA HAI.


CHAND AUR SOORAJ KA SAFAR HAI YE JAB SE YE BANEY HAIN ISI TARHA HAI AUR YE KHUDA KA KANOON HAIN AUR IS MAIN KOI TABDELLI NAHIN DEKHO GAY AP YANI CHAND AUR SOORAJ KI RAFTAR AB AP JO KEH RAHEY HAIN IS MAIN ALLAH KA KANOON TOOTTA HAI JO MUMKIN NAHIN HAI.
AP BESHAK MEHDI HONEY KA DAWA KARO HAMAIN KOI ETRAZ NAHIN HAI PATA NAHIN KITNEY DAWEY DAR MIRZA SAHIB SE PEHLEY GUZAR CHUKEY HAIN JIN KA KOI POOCHNEY WALA NAHIN HAI AP KAR LO GAY TO KUDHA KA KYA BIGHAR LO GAY.JO MIRZA SAHIB SE PEHLEY DAWA KARNEY WALOON NE BIGHAR LIYA


AB MAIN AP KO TARJUMA BATATAOON HOON AUR IS MAIN UN CHAR BATOON K ILAWA JO SAB SE ZAROORI HAI WO B BATATOON HOON WO HAI MEHDI KA HONA.



HAMAREY MEHDI K DO NISHAN HAIN AUR JAB SE ZAMEEN O ASMAN BANEY HAIN KABHI ZAHIR NAHIN HOWEY HIAN(YANI AGAR MEHDI KA DAWEY DAR NA HO TO BESHAK ZAHIR HOWEY HOON) IS MAIN SE AIK YE K RAMZAN K MAHENEY MAIN CHAND GIREHAN IS KI PEHLEY RAT MAIN HO GA.(YANI CHAND GIRAHAN KI JO RATAIN HAIN)AUR SOORAJ GIRHAN US K DINON MAIN SE DARMIYAN K DIN MAIN HO GA(YANI SOORAJ GIRHAN KI TAREKHON MAIN SE DARMIYANI)



AB YAHAN BAT HO RAHI HAI HAMAREY MEHDI KI(MEHDI K DAWEY DAR TO BOHAT THEY MIRZA SAHIB SE PEHLEY)YANI SACHEY MEHDI KI JIS KA NABHI KAREEM :saw: NE HAMAREY KEH KAR MOHAR LAGA DI K JO MEHDI KA DAWEY DAR SACHA HO GA US K HOTEY HOWEY YE NISHAN ZAHIR HO GA.AUR YE AISA WAQIYA HAI K KABHI ROONUMAN NAHIN HOWA NA HO GA (MIRZ SAHIB SE PEHLEY AUR NA BAD MAIN)BESHAK AP TRY KAR LO.


JO TARJUMAN MAIN NE KAHA THA K AP KA SAHI HAI US MAIN AIK BAT HIDEN HAI JO HUM TARJUMA KARTEY WAQAT ZAHIR KARTEY HAIN(YANI KISI MAMOR K LIYE ZAHIR NAHIN HOWA)

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

main ne jo tarjuman likha hai bilkul sahi hai isey kehtey hain b muhawrah na lafzi poorey quran main bamuhawrah tarjuma hota hai merey dost.


Ap jo ab tarjuma kar rahey ho wo kuch yoon hai (agar mainghalat karoon to bata dena) k chand ko gerehan lagey ramzan ki peli rat ho aur sooraj ko lagey darmiyani rat ko.

Is ka jawab dain baki bad main batata hoon

[Irfan_shah]

main ne jo tarjuman likha hai bilkul sahi hai isey kehtey hain b muhawrah na lafzi poorey quran main bamuhawrah tarjuma hota hai merey dost.


Ap jo ab tarjuma kar rahey ho wo kuch yoon hai (agar mainghalat karoon to bata dena) k chand ko gerehan lagey ramzan ki peli rat ho aur sooraj ko lagey darmiyani rat ko.

Is ka jawab dain baki bad main batata hoon

ap jo ab tarjuma kar rahey ho wo kuch yoon hai
(agar mainghalat karoon to bata dena) k

نہیں جناب وہ ترجمہ یہون نہیں یہوں ہے
آپ غور کر لیں
شکریہ

chand ko gerehan lagey ramzan ki peli rat ho

چاندکو گرہن لگے گارمضان کی پہلی رات کو

aur sooraj ko lagey darmiyani rat ko.

اور سورج کو گرہن لگے گا (رمضان کے)درمیان کی کسی رات کو

[Irfan_shah]

[Irfan_shah]

یہ احسان قادیانی نے جواب دیا

mujey umeed thi k ap ye hi kahain gay k ramzan ki pehli tarekh ko yani 1st ramzan aur soraj ko 15 ramzan ko.

Sab se pehli bat ye k chand firehan ki tarekhain 13,14,15 aur soraj girehan ki tarekhain 27,28,29 hain in dinon k ilawa chand ko aur sooraj ko girehan nahin lagta hai merey bhai.
Aghar aisa ho jaye to naaozbillah allah tala ka kaha howa jhot ho jata hai k soraj aur chand ka safar jo aik dosrey k pechey hai us main koi tabdeli nahin dekho gaye.aur khudha apna banaya howa qanoon nahin badalta ye us ki shan k khilaf hai.

Aur sab se khas bat jo ap aur ap k us waqat k ulman bhol gaye they aur sharmindaghi uthai thi wo ye k ramzan k pehley din k chand ko hilal kehtey hain na k kamar .


Jaisey kabhi ap ne ye dekha hai k qamar kameti bethti hai chand dekhney k liye hamesha hilal kamaity bethti hai chand dekhney k liye.




Mirza sahib par ye hadees mukamal tor par poori hoi thi ab ap mano ya na mano hamain aur khudha ko kuch farak nahin parta hai.


Aur jo ap ne murabhi sahib wali bat ki hai ye bilkul ghalat hai q k quran ap k ghar mainb ho ga wahan par lo kahan lafzi tarjuma hota hai sab bamuhawrah hota hai ta k ap samaj sako lafzi tarjuma ap nahin samaj saktey lekin is ka ye matlab nahin hai k wo tarjuma us ayat ya hadees k mazmoon se ikhtilaf khaye merey veer.

[Irfan_shah]

MUJEY UMEED THI K AP YE HI KAHAIN GAY K RAMZAN KI PEHLI TAREKH KO YANI 1ST RAMZAN AUR SORAJ KO 15 RAMZAN KO.

SAB SE PEHLI BAT YE K CHAND FIREHAN KI TAREKHAIN 13,14,15 AUR SORAJ GIREHAN KI TAREKHAIN 27,28,29 HAIN IN DINON K ILAWA CHAND KO AUR SOORAJ KO GIREHAN NAHIN LAGTA HAI MEREY BHAI.
AGHAR AISA HO JAYE TO NAAOZBILLAH ALLAH TALA KA KAHA HOWA JHOT HO JATA HAI K SORAJ AUR CHAND KA SAFAR JO AIK DOSREY K PECHEY HAI US MAIN KOI TABDELI NAHIN DEKHO GAYE.AUR KHUDHA APNA BANAYA HOWA QANOON NAHIN BADALTA YE US KI SHAN K KHILAF HAI.